Translating the wiki


(Airon90) #41

Thank you @jonnehass. You confirm my block position.

Again, it’s not about being able to understand English in order to maintain a pod but it is about getting contents in your own language. It’s simpler to follow instruction in your own language instead of follow instruction in a foreign language.

It doesn’t need to understand English language in order to install a pod if you have a guide in your own language.

I’d prefer not to translate the wiki at all instead of translating only part of it. Sincerely.


(Jonne Haß) #42

It doesn’t need to understand English language in order to install a pod if you have a guide in your own language.

This statement is plainly wrong, as I’ve outlined earlier. You yet didn’t refute the argument that a translated guide would only create the false impression of being able to install and maintain a pod without English knowledge. Therefore I conclude that you only have an opinion and no arguments on the topic, I don’t think that justifies a block, please just vote no to express your opinion. A block should only be used if you have objective arguments against an idea.


(goob) #43

@michaelmoroni

In this way you should create namespaces for every language.

A proposal for that was made a while ago, but was voted down. See https://www.loomio.org/discussions/5662?proposal=4088

So we can’t do that, unless another vote is taken. For the moment, we need to go with what was voted, which is for direct translations from English into different languages all in the main wiki.


(Jonne Haß) #44

@deebaumdeesaster @michaelmoroni would you still block the last proposal? It’s been a year and the language switcher on the guides is just confusing crap.


(Jonne Haß) #45

Proposal: Disallow translation of the installation guides

What changed since the last proposal:

  • We allowed translation of the guides for over a year now, so far no serious or sane attempt has been made.
  • The more serious attempts caused havoc on the English guides and had to be partially reverted.
  • I haven’t met a single podmin who can’t understand enough English to follow the guides.

Additional arguments not mentioned in the last proposal:

  • You need to run a server to run Diaspora. When you run a server you should understand English, at least to be able to respond to eventual abuse notices.
  • If you run a server, in order to keep it secure, you should follow security issues, which are first published in English.
  • Still a lot of documentation external but related to Diaspora is only available in English.
  • We can’t ship example configs in all languages, that would be even harder to maintain. Thus you’ll need some English skills when it comes to configure your pod.
  • The logs are in English. Making these translatable would be insane.
  • We won’t maintain a Changelog, that contains mandatory upgrade notices, in multiple languages.
  • We won’t wait to release until we have release notes in every language we (might) have an installation guide in. Especially for security releases.

Points of the last proposal still stand:

Installing and maintaining Diaspora will at some point need you to understand English, allowing translations of the installation guides in the official wiki would just create the false impression that this isn’t the case. Also a lot of effort went into making the installation guides easy to maintain and therefore always up-to-date, translations effectively harm this effort, bringing more out of date information to this essential part of the community and software.

Agreeing to this proposal will cause any existing translations to be removed from the wiki


Outcome: Translations of the installation guides are no longer allowed.

Votes:

  • Yes: 9
  • Abstain: 0
  • No: 2
  • Block: 1

Note: This proposal was imported from Loomio. Vote details, some comments and metadata were not imported. Click here to view the proposal with all details on Loomio.


Proposing to drop the wiki translations
(Flaburgan) #46

Okay, I’m gonna write a proposal “simplify the installation of diaspora*” ^ ^


(Jonne Haß) #47

@flaburgan such a proposal would be useless.


(Flaburgan) #48

… I was kidding.

People are gonna translate the installation guide anyway, at least for french. So, do we want to keep this translation centralized in the wiki, or do we reject it and let them host it, that’s the real question for me.


(Jason Robinson) #49

Anyone can translate anything they want, but if we vote to disallow translated installation guides, then they should be hosted elsewhere. Simple :slight_smile:


([deactivated account]) #50

Just throwing it out there - If you want to pull the translated guides from the wiki and host/maintain them on the community run diaspora forum (which is gradually building in terms of language support), you guys would be more than welcome to do so :slight_smile:


(Jonne Haß) #51

If you do so, please just make clear that these are no officially supported guides.


(goob) #52

Anyone can translate anything they want, but if we vote to disallow translated installation guides, then they should be hosted elsewhere. Simple

Just what Jason says. In an open project, anyone can fork any of the data and do what they like with it, including translating text, but these forks shouldn’t be ‘officially’ hosted or promoted.


(goob) #53

Besides, people are going to do it anyway.

And that’s fine. The issue is ‘should people be able to do this in the officially hosted D* wiki, or should they do it somewhere else?’


(Faldrian) #54

@Airon90
Maybe we can agree on this: There will be no official translation and whoever wants to translate some documentation should keep their hands from the english guides, so nothing will be messed up.

If people following non-english guides have problems, for example because information is outdated, there will be no support from the official diaspora-channel… only installing using the english documentation is recommended.

I think the main reason for this proposal is to keep the developing community focussed on only ONE version of documentation, so there is less work involved maintaining the official documentation.

If there are non-official translations, that’s fine - as long as people are not blaming the official diaspora support for not keeping them up to date.


(Jonne Haß) #55

@Airon90 I asked two weeks before creating the proposal. Please just disagree, you had enough time to start a discussion. Besides you neglect any argument of the proposal, I wonder if you even read it.


(Jason Robinson) #56

Block is just a no anyway, we’ve voted about that :wink:

No one here is disallowing anything. Just whether translations should be accepted in the official wiki. I doubt anyone would be breaking any laws, our wiki not being governed by law :wink:


(Jonne Haß) #57

Doesn’t mean we can just ignore blocks and shouldn’t try to resolve them.


(Airon90) #58

@jonnehass You asked me if I still block the proposal and I said yes. Nothing is changed since the last discussion in the last year so why are you saying that I have to just disagree?


(Jonne Haß) #59

Time to reread the discussion. There are still arguments you didn’t refute and I don’t see you opposing when I called again 25 days ago, two weeks before opening the new proposal. Also your vote explanation gives the impression that you neither read the proposal nor the discussion that followed it. Since you’re unable to refute all pro arguments, your vote clearly is opinion. Which is fine but shouldn’t be expressed with a block which should have technical or at least objective reasons.


(y.semin) #60

I understand your fears about potentially mistranslated content concerning the D* installation, but what about the resources that come with ? I mean, are you thinking to delete the “end-user-guide” with its help about markdown, with its explanation about general functioning, and its listings of pods, of IRC Channels, and so on ?